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- Latest @ 2019-08-31: We now have an organiser in Garmisch- Partenkirchen: Nigel
Mellersh Contact him via Organisersmail list.
-
Ski Dates
- 2018: We're still skiing, but little time for
web.
Julian Nigel Richard were in Ischgl, 24 & 25th Jan 2014.
( Total 679 km: Inc. a long diversion outward,
12:30-23:15 Munich, Garmisch, Ehrwald, Fern Pass Closed!,
Garmisch, Penzberg, Bad Tolz Kufstein, Innsbruck, Imst,
Kappl, Ischgl, & back direct via re-opened Fern
Pass
Next a bigger group will ski a few days in Mayrhofen
between Mon-Fri 12-16 Feb. We may not announce it to ski@
so ask on ski-org@.
- Join our ski Mail List for
announcements.
- 2016: we briefly announced we're skiing, &
invited skiers to contact organisers. (author only skied
twice so far (shame on me!) but another past organiser has skied
more,) We know our other past fellow skiers who
are still skiing too, but we're losing enthusiasm to
organise crowded weekends. We're moving to un-crowded mid
weeks with good snow when the weather is good:
Luxury Skiing
- 2010-2016 we've not published on web, just on Mail List.
- 2014-2015,
2013-2014, 2012-2013, 2009-2010, 2008-2009, 2007-2008, 2006-2007, 2005-2006, 2004-2005, 2003-2004, 2002-2003, 2001-2002, 2000-2001
- Pre 2000: Yes this author & other organisers have been skiing &
organising from Munich since 1985 & before, but those
dates are long gone, melted in the snows & beers of
memory ;-)
- More Dates Welcome
- Group
 at Mayrhofen
(Finkenberg actually) Austria, 2003.
- Author
 (click for
larger)
- Pics: 2001-01-21, 2003-01-19, 2008-01-20, Finken- berg Nord- hang- bahn, 2013 03 Kitzbuehel
panorama
- Why Ski With US ? :
No Membership Or Trip Fees, No early bus rush, No Smoke, No
Data Harvesting
- JOIN OUR FREE MAIL ANNOUNCEMENT
LISTS
- Mayrhofen Ski Trip
Information
- Kitzbuhel Ski Trip
Information
- Conventions EG Petrol, Credit Cards
etc
- Other Trips
-
Ski Organisers
- Booking Form Removed from use
for now, just email us
- Resorts
- Repairs
-
Other Groups
-
We are totally non commercial.
- You pay us Nothing ... except you pay drivers direct
for petrol, & you may pay a returnable deposit to
organiser to ensure you do turn up, & do not cause
trouble - like a bail bond ;-) .
- No joining fee, No annual membership, No booking
fee.
- Nothing for tuition (we only do a max. of 1
beginner's trip per year, & that's free, except nice
if you buy advisers a drink if the advice seems
useful.
- Nothing for equipment (hire or buy your own, not via
us, we'll just suggest where)
- We start from Munich later than busses !
- We leave resorts considerably later than busses, car
drivers don't tend to drink (this Author/driver strictly
so)
-
We go by Multiple Private Cars. - Far More Flexible
Than Busses !
- Get out of bed Later no need for hellish early Germanicly
inspired 06:30 bus departure of 30 to 50 people. No
crowded train. We don't rush to be first in the
Autobahn Stau, Leave the locals to compete at getting
up so desperately early they _might_ avoid the jams/
Staus. Typically we meet at 08:00.
- We can go somewhere else if the snow report is
bad.
- We can go somewhere else Sunday if Saturday snow
is bad (obviously we think lift tickets, petrol,
time).
- We don't rush down the mountain to the bus to
rush back to Munich. Some of us stay in the Alps for
a drink (non alcoholic. for drivers) &/or bite to
eat after, or half way home, sometimes at favourite
places we've know for years.
- Sometimes (after we're all off the mountain) we
swap passengers between drivers to better match those who want
to lounge & those who want to rush off.)
- If it suits both driver
& passengers, passengers may be may be dropped
off somewhere more mutually convenient at end of
trip, but normally we drop passengers back to Sat AM
collection point. No guarantees. Safety first.
Anywhere on U-Bahn net if desperate. Remember driver
might be very tired after a few hours driving after a
day or 2's skiing.
-
No Data Harvesting
- We don't use web forums or hide behind aliases,
no pseudonyms, we use real human names & email
addresses.
- The Internet
domains we use are NOT owned by commercial
companies, will not be later sold to commercial
operators (as at least one other web forum listed
here was). Our domains do Not harvest your or our
email or web traffic or names. The author guarantees
that.
- We do Not try to recruit you by free restricted
membership, with more services for money. (Unlike at
least one site pointed to here).
- Non Smokers Only. Tobacco stinks worse in the cold
air. Having just non smokers make us more attractive to
to other non smokers. We've not had a smoker on a ski
trip in a decade, & don't need the smell or the the
headache.
- We can all speak English & usually do. We use
singular Du not plural Sie if/when we speak German to
each other (unless > 2 people), no stiff linguistic
baggage ;-)
- We're mostly not new in town, so we've learnt where
to ski. We know a Lot about the areas, & a lot of us
have own cars.
- Our purpose is to SKI, not to Booze (unlike some
group(s) ;-) Sure we drink, but not lots, that's best
left in Munich, when not driving skis or cars.
- You'll also find our other activity mail lists
for Snow Walks & Summer flat & mountain hikes walks, cycle
trips, & Err ;-) .. Drinking on
Saturdays + occasional bowling etc
( Web refs to some random resorts. Just random web refs so
far. )
Top Of Page
Various people have asked me about ski servicing, so here's
my notes: (PS I don't service other people's stuff,
just my own, these are DIY notes, I disclaim all liability,
use your own common sense to decide if you're skilled enough.
) I sharpen my own edges, & also fill my own
grooves & wax my own skis & installed own bindings,
& repair own edges, & have never paid a service shop.
Various people have asked over the years, so I've written
notes below, & am putting them for all at http://www.berklix.org/ski/#repair
Edges
- I have 2 tools: plastic handles with embedded coarse
scraper, but neither much good, & if your hand slips
you get a very nasty cut, so wear gloves. Not ski gloves
cos they're expensive, cheap gloves.
- I only use those old scraper tools occasionally in ski
resorts if desperate I usually wait for a warm day in
Munich, rotate sole side upward, then G clamp the skis to
balcony rail so they cant slip.
- Place wood blocks under skis to make them rest level on
table. Paperback books might do at a pinch in a ski resort,
but some very nasty little bits of sharp metal come off
edges, & you don't want them falling out of pages of a
book you may read in bed.
- I put a special brace over ski stoppers of turntable
Look N 77 bindings, to stop them protruding upward. For
other bindings I retract ski stoppers, then slip a loop of
string or wire over, to stop them protruding. A velcro
strip is not usually strong enough & may slip.
- Wear goggles to protect eyes from metal fragments.
- I then hand apply a power sander (band sander or
rectangular base sander, but not circular sander with a
round disc. & certainly avoid circular disc with a
rounded plate!
- Apply sander gently at right angles to the ski sole =
running surface. Needs a good eye & steady hand to
achieve 90 degrees & not wobble off. Don't press too
hard, or it may take too much off, or produce a rounded
edge.
- Remember not to protrude in on lower side, keep it
vertical, you are Not aiming for the sander to touch the
lower side of the ski, only the perhaps 3mm of vertical
steel & fractional support beyond, on the side of ski
adjacent to the sole, beyond that, the side wall takes a
step in.
- You will need to machine more steel off toward the
middle, than on the ends.
- I had a pair of skis once where the steel edge had
completely torn out of the side of the ski, various shops
said it was irreparable, buy new! I scraped out the dirt,
polished off the rust, cut the end square, clamped the rail
in, drilled a hole through base & hole in rail &
through most of top of ski, cleaned the hole, cut the end
of a pointed nail, poured hot epoxy resin in hole, left to
set for 2 days, more hot resin between metal edge & ski
above, waited 2 days, removed clamps, cut off surplus nail,
metal file to polish base. I used it for many years
after.
Grooves
- Ski until no wax left on the base
- Scrape remnant wax off with a special steel plate I
have in the past skis made the mistake of not holding the
scraper plate vertical to the ski, then plate bends in, in
the middle, & you get a sole that is concave instead of
flat.
- If you've ripped out a 2cm hole under foot, by the
edge, doing an emergency stop on stone, it may be so deep
you first need a bit of epoxy resin.
- Ski shops sell repair sticks one can set light to &
drop the liquid plastic material along the groove.
Translucent & black are colours I have.
- Don't get it on your skin, hurts lost more than candle
wax, (as also does hot glue gun)
- It shrinks a bit as it cools, so if you have a deep
groove, put a bit more on than you expect you'd need.
- Its not as strong as ski base, so will eventually tear
out again.
- It will initially keep going out, so place a candle in
a tin can, more stable & easier than matches or a
lighter.
- Take the molten end of the burning stick along above
the groove at the right speed, to just lightly over fill
the groove.
- Later it will get too hot, & burn & run too
fast, so have multiple sticks, to allow others to cool off.
To avoid wasting material you can set both stick on fire
for a bit, hold together, blow out & keep stationary
while they cool.
- Working on a cold day is better, else it too quick
burns too fast.
- It makes a real mess, have newspaper under full length
of skis.
- The burning wax easily accelerates into a burning line
of liquid plastic, the longer you work. It needs string
lungs to blow it out. After you don't want more on the ski,
stick & below is still burning , I've seen the
newspaper catch on fire, so have bucket of water handy on
the balcony. Don't do this job in a ski room of
in-flammables.
- Lastly, draw the steel plate at 90 to ski, backward
along length of ski, gently taking off thin layers of
plastic. Newspaper underneath to collect the plastic
shavings.
Waxing
- There's block waxing, rubbing on skis (slipping &
cutting hands) can also be done on piste.
- There's spray waxing, can also be done on piste,
propellant might not meet Green approval.
- There's hot waxing, can be done from a mini bath of hot
wax in a ski rental shop. Or You can buy a special ski
iron, they're expensive, but smaller if packing for a long
sojourn racing in the alps. I just iron at home, good
enough for weekend trips from Munich.
- If you wax on the mountain, don't perfectionist wax one
ski before starting the other, do a bit on each, switching.
A friend may ski up out of the blue, & not want to
wait, leaving you on unbalanced skis .. which may unnerve
you, before realising it doesn't make so much difference on
steep slopes.
- Waxes are designed for temperature ranges. I once used
the wrong wax, it got too warm down the Trampelpfad from
Kitzbuhel to Jochberg, it became a very tedious push too
early.
- Set the electric iron to low temperature
- Don't use same iron you use for clothes. It takes ages
to unscrew iron, remove all wax from gaps &
re-assemble. Also I had a girl friend who grabbed my iron
from cupboard without realising I'd done my skis with it,
& though it was OK for my mens handkerchiefs, minute
scores in the base, & remnant wax didn't go well with
frilly material ;-)
Binding Installation
- Most modern skis have a centre line half way along the
ski.
- Needs a drill stand, vital to drill vertical
- Vital to drill holes just the right size. Buy the
special size the binding manufacturer recommends. Its not a
standard diameter found in normal UK / Imperial / German
metric DIY sets.
- To avoid drilling too deep, wrap a bit of insulating
tape around drill bit.
- I used hair dryer to warm epoxy resin i poured into
mounting holes seconds before screwing bindings in.
- Ken Lawler may have other tips,
particularly how to saw the back of old skis, &
re-screw bindings further forward (difficult as skis
thinner there), to teach the short ski method (Ski
Evolutif), I have cc'd Ken via ski-org@
We already list Fackel Wanderung, as well as all forms of
skiing, but we would be delighted if someone wanted to
organise eg: snow shoe walking, sledging, rodel, ice skating
on { a Munich canal (eg Nymphenburg), lake (eg Maisinger See
SW of Starnberg) or { frozen tennis court by a ski lift - aka
Finkenberg base station) }
Top Of Page
It was suggested I prepare outline How-To notes to encourage
new Ski Organisers, & noted
that organising the accommodation is perhaps the most
interesting area of advice for an inexperienced/ new ski
organiser. Paul has also asked me. Emails/tips from other
experienced Ski Organisers to fill
out this section are welcome, if not received, I may
eventually get round to it myself. Meantime, if you read the
briefing notes for attenders of my annual down hill
for Beginners & Experienced - Mayrhofen trip, you'll
have a good idea of what to do & what to avoid.
Top Of Page
We have a web based ski booking form available for some
trips. Most other trips are still booked direct with Ski Organiser. (When time is found by Julian he will do more
work automating the back end behind the booking form, for
detail processing, & then offer an extended version to
any others Ski Organisers who may
want it.)
Top Of Page
There's lots of conventions us regular club skiers are used
to, for most just ask the regular club skiers, or the Ski Organiser, Here's a couple of
examples:
- We very rarely go to hotels that accept credit cards -
bring Cash ! - All the other passengers in the car haven't
got any interest in going to a more expensive hotel or
restaurant, & all paying a lot more, just so's you can
use your credit card, (even if we could find somewhere to
take a card) so Bring Enough Cash.
- Petrol money: we normally aim to fill standard cars
with 4 people, & leave the 3 passengers to pay all
petrol, leaving driver to incur
depreciation (think salt water corrosion & heavy engine
wear on mountains etc), that way we help encourage
sufficient drivers to suffer the
corrosive salted & gritted winter roads, &
increased risk of collision etc. If the driver has not bought rack & chains,
passengers sometimes deduct the price of a beer from petrol
money, & buy a beer over the weekend for the driver who was kind enough to synchronise
his vehicle & squeeze their skis onto his rack etc,
thus encouraging more drivers to
invest in rack & chains.
- We pretty much always stop for a drink after skiing
& don't rush off. The drivers
don't booze it up though.
- Passengers should synchronise withdrivers travel plans, be back on time from
skiing, & not order meals when rest are planning to
leave.
- Drivers co-ordinate plans with their fellow
drivers.
- Passengers are normally head counted after skiing by
their own driver.drivers make mutual
check arrangements among each other. Passengers of a
missing /late driver should report the missing skier to
other drivers.
- We don't come back early to unlock vehicles for non
skiers.
- A meal on the way back to Munich is optional, subject
to driver - depends if stomach
demanding food to digest, plus aching muscles demanding
blood to rebuild, may deprive brain of blood supply to
concentrate on driving.
- We probably have other conventions too, which are
easier remembered in the snow fields than typing here in
Munich
Top Of Page
Notes On Rows & Columns In Yearly Calendars
Notes On Columns In Yearly Calendars
-
Type:
- Down=Down hill,
- Tour=Ski Tour,
- Lang=Langlauf=Cross
Country.
- All=All types of skier
welcome.
- Where more than one type, main emphasis is listed
first.
-
Skill:
- Beg=Beginners (ie
including absolute beginners),
- Exp=Experienced.
- Any=Any level of
experience or lack thereof.
- Organiser: Name of
organiser. Click on it for more info.
- Destination: Ski Organisers please tell me web
references(URL) for your Destination Resort, for Ski Map
info etc, & I'll make it click-able from the
table.
- Free/ Commercial
club trips are organised free (but you still have to pay
various lifts & accommodation & petrol etc), but we
also list some Semi Commercial Trips:
Most of Ken's trips
are marked "Semi Commercial". on those the organiser's
prime aim is to teach people skiing, for which he offers a
commercial package, charges money, & bundles in
equipment provision, tuition, accommodation & (I think)
lift pass) A few experienced club skiers sometimes join
those groups without taking the package.
- Comment: Odd extra
info.
Notes On Rows In Yearly Calendars
- A row of dashes '-' (or empty boxes) is a date
available for an Ski Organiser
(unless below a preceeding multi day trip).
- Trips such as Ken's commercial trips & Peter's
Private trip maybe shown in {{brackets}}.
Top Of Page
- The annual ski planning meal enables us to
optimise/maximise the amount of ski trips available during
the ski season. It was started after we had a dry January one
year: the snow was good, but we fumbled the planning, &
had no down hill weekend for 3 weeks.
- We try to maximise the number of full weekends available
but get lower turnout if we have adjacent full weekends, so
we try to alternate full weekends & day trips on
successive weekends.
- We get fewer weekends if we first ad hoc book the easy to
organise single day trips on any random weekend Ski Organisers bid for; so instead it's
better to try to schedule the 2 day full weekends trips
first, on alternate weekends, & then add the one day
trips in between.
- We try when possible to avoid a full weekend on
Fasching's party weekend; we often do a one day trip then,
Sunday usually.
- The timetable needs to account for Christmas & Easter. EG 1
day trips on weekends when accommodation is hard to find, 2
days (or more) when easy.
- We sometime run 2 trips the same day, EG Langlauf &
down hill, but a few Ski Organisers
do more than one form of skiing, & don't want to miss
out, so sometime we do EG langlauf on Saturday & down
hill on Sunday (or vice versa), rather than 2 1 day &
none the other day same weekend.
- Langlauf dates: try: Munich International Ski Club
- We usually (but not always) manage to avoid EG a 1 day
down hill in one resort on the same weekend a 2 day down hill
trip in a different resort.
- We also arrange small groups not officially announced,
often at short notice via eg winterised beer gardeners
& ski@ ).
- Hanenkamm date in
2006 clashed with Mayrhofen
trip so might be Traffic jams to avoid in future years
?.
- Top Of Page
- The schedule used to be organised with identical papers
with dates in front of each Ski
Organiser at the ski planning meal, for bids for dates
& then collated, discussed & dates shuffled to
optimise use of weekends. As that was best typed, & as we
usually know a few requests in advance, it's helpful to list
those too, & as the info will be published on web &
email it's convenient to list early tentative plans on the
web too. Some years Julian just provides a giant
sheet, & all trips are marked up, that system works well
with smaller numbers, but problems of wet table & dark
restaurants. Torch useful ! In 2004 Julian also had a laptop
loaded & ready with the planning table, (which would have
made inserting extra mid week trips in particular, rather
easier, but then paper was used as more easily review-able by
all the group (passing a laptop around among glasses of beer,
& plates of food is problematic.
- Details can be registered on this list by emailing or
phoning Julian.
- These dates are NOT fixed, they're just some initial
wishes of some individual Ski
Organisers & will likely be changed somewhat when Ski Organisers together at & after
the annual Ski Organisers planning
meal, when we optimise the season's schedule.
-
First Come First Served ? - No It's Not That Simple
!
- It is not necessarily first come first served for
this timetable, neither by email bids nor on the planning
night.
- it seems best to optimise the ski timetable to
maximise ski enjoyment & safety etc, for the skiers,
not simply to satisfy whichever Ski
Organiser managed to bid first by email, or managed
to arrive on time for the ski meal.
- Full weekend ski trips in prime snow time (Jan to
mid/late Feb) are considered valuable, not to be messed
up by less than experienced Ski
Organisers, so it's appreciated if newer Ski Organisers to the group first do
one day trips, & smaller 2 day trips out of prime
time, until they've shown the group they have the proven
organisational ability to extend to reliably &
successfully organise large groups in prime snow time.
(There's a lot to get right, or wrong, in a full weekend,
& only a few optimal dates in a short season, so we
can't afford to waste any).
- "First come" might (or not) be OK for langlauf, which
generally is low death/serious injury risk compared to
down hill or ski tour.
- When you get to be standing on a steep mountain,
perhaps teaching down hill beginners how to crash
properly & avoid broken arm/legs etc, or teaching
tourer-s avalanche danger
assessment etc, then competence is more important than
who made first claim.
- There's other criteria, equally doubtless skiers will
think of & understand them better than non skiers,
& be more affected by the decisions than non skiers,
so such decisions are best left to skiers !
- It's optimal if we first try to work out from other
constraints, which weekends are best for 1 or 2 day trips,
then Ski Organisers choose dates
available ?
- Like to organise a trip yourself? - Pick a free date above & get advice from other Ski Organisers.
- Date Arbitration/decision etc is by the body of Ski Organisers.
-
Top Of Page
Another Group: Richard
Gipps' Ski Tourers group
Click above, then on "Activity Groups -> # Munich -> #
Sports & Leisure -> # Alpine Division -> #
Activities "
International business group, pay subscriptions if you want
real sports event info, not just Munich drinking venues with
entry fees.
Top Of Page
Another Group: Ken Lawler's Short Ski
Beginners Group
http://parallelskiing.com/
http://parallelskiing.ws24.cc
Ken's group is a Verein (club e.v.). There's numerous of our
people there & vice versa. Many good recommendations too,
& he does one open trip, no tuition or charges etc for us
too. Ken's group provides equipment, beginners training,
accommodation & lift tickets for a fee.
Top Of Page
Paraski,
a Yahoo group run by HanZi Field, who took Ken's beginner course in maybe
2002. HanZi went skiing nearly every weekend and was always
looking for passengers and drivers to
go along. Hanzi also does barbecues in summer, & overlaps
with people in our circles. @2013 Paraski seemed inactive.
@2016-02 still inactive: last 2 posts in March 2013
Top Of Page
One day trips, weekend, long weekend and week long trips. Day
trip cost per person in 2004: Members - Eur. 35, Non-members
- Eur. 45, Long trips: February 20 - 24 Kranjska Gora,
Slovenia, Italy at Easter. 3 - 10 April. Madesima resort.
Entry fee of 10 Euro, & Annual Membership of 30 Euro
(when last I looked).
2013 quote: The bus WILL depart at 06:45 so you need to be
there for 06:30
Top Of Page
Railway, bus companies and sport shops offer day trips with
transport maybe breakfast and lift pass built in. They leave
very early in the morning (typically German !) and leave the
resort too early as well, even more typically German ! I've
never tried them, as I aim to arrive at top of mountain with
last lift, maybe admire the view or have a drink, wait for
the crowd to clear off, then ski down & have another
drink & a cake in a cafe/bar. Forget that relaxed idea if
you'r on a commercial German bus.
-
Can book with with Sport Scheck tel 54907560 or Sport
Scheck Travel Agency 38014151 {Mail from Ken} Email Day
trips to Hoch-Zillertal every Wed, Fri, Sat Sun (till 6th
of april) . 6:50 from Haupt-bahnhof (in front of
Karstadt). Wed/Fri for 34 Euro, Sat/Sun for 41 Euro
(prices inclusive return bus trip, ski pass &
breakfast) {Mail from Ken}
-
(info 23707299) also offers Tages- fahrten - destinations
are announced on the Wed. before, so drop in at Sport
Schuster (Marienplatz) and pick up a leaflet and to book.
Go to their travel agency on the first floor and ask for
the Tages-fahrten - these trips don't make it onto the
web site: Prices around 40 Eur. (depending where you go)
inclusive return bus trip & ski pass. Bus leaves
07.30 from 'Rinder-markt', behind Sport Schuster,
Marienplatz. Book a place, don't just turn up! {Mail from
Ken}
-
Offers the Kombi-Ticket: Transport and ski pass
Schliersee-Spitzingsee 33 Euros BayerischZell-Sudelfeld
32 Euros Lengries-Brauneck 31 Euros Tickets In the main
hall at the Hauptbahnhof (DB-desk 47 or 49) info: 08024
997171 {Mail from Ken}
- Big companies such as Siemens
& Hypo vereins bank & EPO (European Patent
Office)
also organise occasional ski trips for employees &
freelancers working there. Ask around, your quiet colleague
might be a secret ace skier ;-)
- A lot of UK ski package tours fly in via Munich, It used
to be possible, so probably still is, to hook up with some if
you make your own way to the airport.
- Some accommodation places are well know for lively &
late night groups
,
maybe possible to meet others there & try skiing together
for a bit.
- Top Of Page
- Water
Ski
- https://skimap.org/SkiAreas/view/634
Zillertal 3000
- www.schneehoehen.de/schneehoehen/oesterreich/tirol
schneehoehen.de
.. mayrhofen Sells hotel beds; might be useful for
links.
-
Severe Swaying Ski Lift
- Video -
Storm in Ischgl - Monday 2018-01-22
-
Question:, In such a cabin, Which side is best to sit ?
Up or Down ?
The yachtsman reflex is Upside, to stiffen the cabin
back toward vertical, discourage shipping water, &
bring more wind on to sail, but more wind pressure
might more likely derail cable off the wheels.
As lighter cabins with no humans in sway more,
reducing a manned cabin angle will not reduce chance of
a mast collision somewhere else on the cable loop.
The major danger I guess is not that one's own cabin
derails, but that other more exposed cabins dis-rail. I
believe the only braking on most cable loops is via the
main drive wheels top & bottom. So if enough cabins
slip off the pylon/ mast wheels, the length of the loop
will increase, the concrete counterweight in bottom
station could descend to the base of containing hole,
then no friction on base station winding wheel, &
the whole loop could rotate back down the mountain,
whichever side is heavier. Even worse, the loop might
derail off the base wheel.
What speed cable cars have to slow & stop at I
don't know, presumably different maximal wind gust
speeds for different things:
- Unloading cabins coming into the stations: many
have a vertical alignment pin or guide underneath
that needs to engage.
- When cabins sway sideways too much, the windward
side of the endless loop, cabin verticals gripping
the steel rope would strike the wheels mounted on the
pylons, cabins would strike masts.
- Chance of derailment of steel rope from rubber
lined steel wheels, is probably mostly a factor of
profile of rubber lined wheel, how shallow, & how
high the metal rim. IMO rubber is fairly shallow. The
twisted wire rope might start to grip & climb the
rubber edge of the wheel lining ?
Presumably empty cabins that sway more provide less
wind resistance, but less weight, wonder if derailment
would start (but not end with!) empty cabins or
occupied ?. I assume just while going over pylon
wheels, more weight would be good, but maybe if all the
intermediary cabins are empty, less aggregate sideways
push. Impossible :-)
I have very rarely seen lots of concrete weights
with steel handles in cable stations, one ready for
each cabin; (usually just occasional beer crates, &
in the past containers of fuel oil, but diesel driven
stations seems increasingly rare.
Other considerations:
- Cable de-torsioning & over-torsioning around
the base & top drive wheels caused by different
angles of cabins hanging in open air &
stations.
- Fraying of rubber wheel liners abraded by spiral
cable rotated on to edge of wheel liners.
- Torsional force around the verticals of cabins
that don't have humans balanced, one at front &
one at back. Those cable clamps are always rather
small just a few cm to take torsional strain if you
look closely, the long bits are too support stress
fore & aft, not rotational stress.
Some things to look at in old photos of ski lifts,
& take new photos on next ski trip. (Mayrhofen, Feb
2018)
- Top Of Page
Problems Happen - Be Prepared !
Experienced ski Organisers know
things can go wrong, & we try to plan ahead. We also ask
trip participants to also keep thinking ahead too, taking
personal responsibility, & trying to help organiser where
possible. Anticipating the unexpected (& the expected) is
what experienced Ski Organisers
& skiers do, but no matter how hard we plan, something
else may get us ;-) That's not to put you off skiing or
organising, (that too can be fun), just that it's easier when
people Think & Plan ahead too.
"SKI TRIPS FROM HELL ?" Not Really
(Good phrase for a search engine to catch more skier
interest though ? ;-)
Here's some problems this Ski
Organiser recalls (from decades of trips, not all on 1
true trip from hell ! (ordered roughly in the order a ski
trip happens).
-
Organisation pre start:
- It gets busy pre departure, this author once
organised (unpaid, in his own time) a ski trip with 39
skiers (41 booked, but 2 ill), inc. lots of beginners,
& about 13 cars ...
- Passengers, even car drivers
can be unexpectedly ill, a no show at departure point,
or car is problematic (doesn't happen much,drivers generally feel responsibility
& cancel with organiser even if it has to happen
night before, so only a problem for organiser to alert
reserve driver, if any).
- Lack of cars, or passengers for booked cars, lack
of snow chains for glaciers, winter tyres, ski racks,
inadequate anti-freeze, cars doors locked solid, car
break downs. Yes, someone did run out of fuel
& various of us nearly have, thats why we carry
spare fuel (that passengers then sometimes complain
smells & takes space). Yes we've had dodgey
batteries (the driver of a car
with a good battery & jump leads waits for dodgey
car to start). We've had ski racks spring open in
transit, luckily no skis took flight.
-
Border, Passports, Austrian currency for Autobahn
Pickerl
- Driver turned back at the border,
'cos of no passport, dodgy car papers, & passenger
left with no driver.
- Car impounded by border police,
sudden extra passenger & skis to squeeze into
whichever cars if any remain behind the impounded
one.
- Passengers with no Passports. A lone dark Indian
face gets noticed best without a passport on a sunny
day ;-)
- Sat Morning: Screen wash jets freeze up on the road,
emit ice on screen.drivers can be
too mean, & passengers too when they complain that
expensive extra petrol money also include screen wash. Is
it an optional luxury to see where the vehicle is driving/
sliding ?!
- Stuck without chains, can't get up
- Drivers who insisted
on using junk cars, & thus having otherdrivers with better cars leave theirs in
Munich. One got stuck up top
without chains, he & passengers couldn't get down icy
road back to valley, hotels & home.
-
Skiing
- People who forget equipment money & passports
to rent equipment.
- Sat Morning: Snow storm so heavy it takes most of
day to drive to Ischgl, then 3 people use 1 afternoon
ticket & return to bar & give away ticket to
next it's so bad no 4th person will take the free
ticket.
- Chair up gets stuck in a blizzard for maybe an hour
up at Hintertux (too high & windy & dangerous
to continue movement).
- Friends you don't even recognise, faces distorted
by cold. Again Hintertux.
-
Sat Night After skiing:
- Injury - worse if it
its the driver! Is the car insured for other
drivers?
- Passengers forget which car, or where. Blizzard up
at Hintertux rips paper notes off windscreen.
- Road closure from avalanche danger, skiers stranded in
ski boots in bar now closing, no hotels left, no money
& passports for hotels either, cars blocked by
locked barrier from driving through avalanche endangered road to reach
rooms containing normal shoes, clothes, passports,
money & beds for the night.
- Ski drivers & passengers
separated, lost from each other, now on different
mountains/valley stations, after having been separated
by lack of visibility, piste closed by avalanche danger, different
speed/ability etc. Lost skiers & missing drivers,
can't stick notes to wind screens 'cos the snow ice
wind sleet rain & dark defeat paper ink & you,
& it's slow walking in ski boots, & the last
bus has gone, & taxis are expensive, or no racks,
or just not available
-
Sat After Lifts Close, Finkenberg
-
Skiers
stuck in dead end valleys, night closing in, hours
of hard work ahead: either walking up mountain back
to piste at top of mountain (to reach piste to
valley) or the same but hours skiing in increasing
dark through raw forest. Then dogs start howling.
Well, back behind walls & at lower altitudes
everyone tells you it must have been valley dogs.
When you'r alone up the top of a mountain all
people have left 2 hours ago, darker by the minute,
you'r entitled to a different guess! Dogs ? maybe.
& then down, Passengers &drivers separated & clueless of
whereabouts, should rescue services be called, what
would they find in the dark, what would it Cost ?!.
No mobile phones then (& coverage even now far
from overall).
- Finkenberg End Of Day # 2
Skiers stuck in same dead end valleys, lifts
closed, off piste the other way (N end) all the way
to valley.
-
Sat after skiing: hunting beds:
- Lack of hotel rooms
- Can't book pensions often for 1 night.
- Never enough single rooms.
- Fools who were told before trip, Cash, no Cards,
then want us all to stay in (or driver to drive them to) an expensive
hotel cos they have no cash for B&B.
- Idiots
who even half way up one mountain then down the next
hunting for rooms, argue Demand their absolute "Right"
to a single room, where no rooms single or double are
to be had, (& where if any singles are, usually
single drivers are offered them
first to ensure a good sleep & safer drive home
next day).
- Can't find where booked pensions are. (Austrian
villages number buildings in villages chronologically,
according to when the first building was on site, maybe
centuries back, maybe an old low numbered building has
since been replaced by a new looking building. Street
names often don't get used. & They leave Green
"Free" signs out when not free.
- Can't drive to B&B 'cos too steep narrow &
icy ! (yes, even too steep for this author's previous
powerful car, which had All of: 4 snow chains, winter
tyres, 4wheel drive, divide by 2transmission reduction,
& turbo - still too steep / slippery (well even if
I got up there, was I going to find space to turn,
& how was I going to get other party cars up there
? Would I have to spend hours moving multiple car loads
of people skis & luggage all up the mountain in my
one car ? where would we leave all the other cars ?
What if it snowed again overnight ?
- Hotel rooms stolen by club members
not booked on the trip.
- Sat night (driver
decides cold night, not enough anti freeze, set alarm
to about 3 AM to get up, go out & run up engine to
heat.
- Sat Night/Sun Morning Mugging (Robbery) of party member
.
- Sun. Afternoon Blizzard
:
The odd blizzard perhaps with a group of you on a snow
slope of 45 degrees, a few miles from human habitation,
(skiers car groups are never sorted by ski ability, so ski
groups comprise assorted passengers &drivers belonging to car groups of skiers
elsewhere on same or loosely adjacent mountains. Visibility
about as far as the end of your ski tip ! Needing to stab
sticks in snow to see if moving/ drifting. Curious sensory
deprivation !
- Sun. Night Solden pre new lift :
Rush to leave car park before dead end glacier tunnel is
locked for the night. No time to get chains on. Road down
is icier than road up (rained & froze during day).
Nothing at all on edge of road. driver scared car might slip sideway off
edge. 3 passengers pushing car sideways while driver alone in car drives down! (Solden,
before they put in another lift up to the glacier).
-
Sun Morning:
- Broken rib, broken arm reported to the organiser at
breakfast, before 1st coffee, reported by an aggressive
fool
threatening the organiser to beat him up, because
organiser didn't know, wasn't told, & was skiing a
different mountain with a different group from a
different car yesterday, & this is the first he's
heard, no one having reported it earlier, as the
injured's friend's took him to hospital & he's been
dealt with & quite alright (as he assures us later
on his return).
- Sun. Morning Irate land ladies "You'r the
organiser, so who of yours had that illicit unpaid
mixed sauna for 2?"
- Broken/stolen skis boots sticks
- Sun Night Return
-
- People who tell drivers they
`must' be driven back up mountain fast to return gear
before shop closes, or `must' return early to Munich
(no chance! Idiots just cause annoy themselves &
all others.)
- Sun. Night: Chains removed in road lay by, A while
later a smell builds, someone had bad food ? Nope, the
chains were removed where there was frozen dog
excrement , its now melted into the carpet.
- Border Again!Once we had a dark faced Indian
friend who'd forgotten his passport, returning from
Austria to Munich in the old days when they checked
every car passenger's passport (They still do when they
suspend Schengen occasionally for a special event. Even
worse, he was a beginner, hired skis there, the other 3
of us had our skis on the roof rack, & customs were
often seen to count heads & skis as an easy
check.
- Sun night.: very new car, drives all the way back
to Munich, then 1st petrol station off autobahn &
inside ring near Giesing, Subaru clutch cable break !
Wow ! Was that luck or what ?
- Sun night.: 50 KM out from Munich head lamps of new
car dim: So driver tells
passengers: off with radio, off with heater blower, off
with rear de-mister off with headlights, down to side
lights & tail lights, & hope there's enough
battery drive ignition to get to Munich. Then some
idiot passenger complains they're cold & turn on
the heater! - No we're all cold ! Do you want car
stranded on Autobahn ?
Turns out later Subaru had used too many cable ties on
the earth cable between engine & chassis, no room
for wobble, metal fatigue in copper cable.
- Passenger
claiming Sunday morning to have no money to pay hotel
or driver's petrol money. Pretence kept up all the way
to Munich, till driver
said he intended to leave that
passenger's new skis locked on roof, & auction them
off down the club next Friday at low price to raise
petrol money. Miraculously money to pay for hotel &
petrol was then found ;-)
Again, the purpose of the above list is Not to scare you
off, it took decades for all of those to happen. But you
Should keep alert, planning ahead, & help the
organiser where possible. Mentally lazy passengers are a
nuisance, think ahead !
Top Of Page
Driving back to Munich Sunday nights can be tiring after
skiing hard,maybe a bad nights sleep if sharing a twin room,
& worse, a meal in the mountains driving home, (this
author doesn't eat in the mountains now Sunday evening,
better to be hungry & awake). If maybe sleepy passengers
are not holding up their end of conversations keeping driver
awake it can be worse. (Your driver may invite you to have a
good contentious debate to keep hm awake, or play devils
advocate, play along ! ;-)
Alternately, for
about 10 Euro you can buy an mp3 player that powers of a car
cigarette lighter socket It takes SD cards & USB
sticks up to 2Gig, Before the ski trip one can download free
documentary & comedy programmes etc from eg www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/
to help one keep awake driving Try also http://www.archive.org
Ski Avalanche People Search Detectors
- We don't usually do ski
tour (where these are advised), we usually don't have
them, & usually (not always) stay on piste.
-
I was asked by a ski tourer if
smart phones could interfere with these devices ? I'm
working out the answer below, adding info as it comes in,
I would
appreciate technical info no hear-say please, back your
statements with URLs (web refs)!):
tiscover bed booker for Zillertal
Years ago, we were part of a largely non skiers club that
died. The grey box below was to deter various non skier
committee members etc, who used to periodically dump ignorant
criticism on Ski Organisers. A list
of some problems we've survived was
written to show them just how clueless of ski organising they
were, to encourage them Not to push their ignorant opinions.
We're long rid of those people, but stories of some `problems' & events still entertains
occasionally over a beer
Each time there's a skiing problem, one receives a
few un-solicited & usually un-informed comments
from non skiers who seem to all too often make the
ignorant assumption (sub-conscious or conscious) that
organising a ski trip should be based on similar
principles to those used to organise other events
most of which are of a far more trivial nature, EG
trip to a Munich restaurant. Non skiers often don't
bother asking nearly enough questions before issuing
their frequently un-informed opinions, & it gets
tedious trying to politely explain the many things
they hadn't realised or bothered to ask. It's of
course possible for non skiers, & skiers of
limited experience to have useful ideas, & for
those we're grateful, but please ask _lots_ of
questions before you allow an idea to grow to an
opinion formed in ignorance, that could likely cause
annoyance if thrust un-asked on Ski Organisers.
-
Get Experience:
- Learn to ski (any type of ski) ! - Your
perceptions may change.
- If you've tried Langlauf & weren't
scared ...
- Try down hill, its faster & more
dangerous,
- Try Ski Tour. - sometime slower than down
hill, can be more dangerous though.
- Realise not all off piste is [equally]
dangerous
- Read some analysis of avalanche angles,
layers, chunky layers, & lower sliding
surfaces.
- Try walking up some mountains in summer
you've skied down the winter before. Consider
the tracks & gradients & erosion.
- Go as a skier on lots of trips.
- Graduate from Bus trips where it's easy
& all Must conform, to private car trips,
where there's more to co-ordinate &
organise, & accommodation to find etc.
- Organise some Ski Trips, start on 1 day
trips, easier.
- Organise complete ski weekends, needing to
find accommodation up & down the valley
etc.
- Organise beginners trips
- Keep doing it for 10 to 20 years for a
club. Remember Ski
Organisers mistakes (yours & others),
logistical contingencies & accidents &
problems your skiers have been caught out by in
the mountains, & learn from them, & try
to plan to avoid them etc.
- Encourage other Skiers to both help out on
big trips & also organise other trips
- ... And now the hard bit ... ;-)
- Sigh when non skiers dump unsolicited
opinions on you about ski matters !
- A few of us are experienced Ski Organisers who have done most
or all the above list.
Ski trips, particularly down hill/tour & full
weekend trips are much more complex & potentially
dangerous & need much more forward planning than
simple club events such as the trivial booking of a
meal in a city Restaurant, that many experience as a
club `Event', that the ignorant sometimes
[un]consciously draw parallels with, when forming
opinions on how all club events should be organised
& who is `entitled' to what.
Non skiers would be wiser to ask a Lot more
questions before forming an opinion, or worse,
pushing ignorant un-solicited opinions on experienced
ski Organisers.
|
- Contact Ski Organisers well in
advance for weekend trips (deposits often required).
- All routes & destinations subject to snow conditions
and car seats available, snow & road conditions, & Ski Organisers decisions.
- Events can be relocated, postponed or cancelled if
necessary without notice, for instance due to snow or traffic
conditions, lack of enough participants or transport, or
indisposition of Ski
Organisers.
- Check your e-mail, pay attention to announcements at the
Friday. Stammtisch, and always confirm booking with the Ski Organiser beforehand.
- Don't just turn up (unless the Ski
Organiser specifically advertises that is acceptable), as
there may well be no space for you.
- If you must cancel, formally cancel direct with the Ski Organiser so he/she knows.
No-shows who muck up our car & or hotel sharing plans are
not welcome on subsequent trips, Ski
Organisers mention names of no shows to fellow Ski Organisers.
- Weekend trips often require advance booking and deposits
paid, which we & your friends drink at your expense, if
you fail to show up without adequate warning.
- Events are organised by volunteers. Participation is
entirely at your own risk and on your own responsibility.
Organisers, drivers, & fellow skiers etc disclaim All
responsibility - if you do not accept that, do not come.
- Top Of Page
- Format & Content in whole & in parts, Copyright
Julian Stacey,
Munich 2001-2013.
- Permission granted to make links to this & other
pages.
- Top Of Page
Glacier Skiing
Hintertux, Sölden, Stubai, Pitztal
Body Protection
American footballers wear shoulder pads... 30 years back I
had racing ski trousers with soft padded knees round to hips. (But not a hard outer shell
back then). Elderly non skiers have hip protectors, so I
wonder if high speed professional slalom skiers might be able
to use similar technology for knee or hip protectors ?
Analogy: skiers didn't use to wear helmets. Cricketers wore
no face protectors etc.
Emergency Phone Numbers told me at Nederle near Kappl near
Ischgl 2018-01-24 at www.nederle.at
- 112 European Notruf Innsbruck
- 122 Fuer-Wehr
- 133 Polizei Not-fall Im Tal
- 144 Berg Rettung
www.lawinenwarndienst-bayern.de/res/archiv/messdaten/saisongrafik.php
PS A clip from email: I've done a lot of skiing, & plan
to do more. Competitive racer skiers can wear their knees out
by 25 years old Most recreational skiers dont do real racing:
(when knees act like shock absorbers), I've done a very
little semi racing earlier in life (skiing a mountain, not
just a slope as fast as possible, but it's damn dangerous,
only think of it when slopes are empty & visibility is
good, & your muscles will be screaming at you, so are you
really in control to emergency stop ? most probably not, even
more probably not if you ve stuck a ski cam on your helmet.
I've not skied whole mountains non stop in decades, too
dangerous, the laws of Kinetic energy are non negotiable.
(Most normal recreational ski injuries will be twists &
breaks I imagine, not worn out knee linings from absorbing
repetitive bump shocks.).
See Also: ../bike/#knees &
../walk/#knees
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